What constitutes as counterevidence here? In my opinion, the only way for countering the attack, is to ask the clients themselves, by a third-party. I've stated over and over my response to the evidence, however I don't see anything I can post that would satisfy your suspicions.
Ethics of Review Incentives
- Thread starter CrazyTech
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Great job Anand! Completely avoid what has been asked. You must be taking some political courses in school too where they teach you to completely avoid the questions being asked.
Its rather ironic.
At first you said, "we never had a client cancel on us."
Then, "we have had clients cancel on us" all within a matter of minutes.
Shame on you for lying.
AND at the same time that was the same response you gave me when we discussed the newsletter on MSN. Merely changing your story in a matter of minutes. When will you stop your lying?
John
John
Its rather ironic.
At first you said, "we never had a client cancel on us."
Then, "we have had clients cancel on us" all within a matter of minutes.
Shame on you for lying.
AND at the same time that was the same response you gave me when we discussed the newsletter on MSN. Merely changing your story in a matter of minutes. When will you stop your lying?
John
John
jmweb said:
It was asked that I provide evidence; I responded saying what would constitute as evidence, as it seems justification is not sufficient for you.
As for the cancellations, is that even related to what is being asked? During Oct-Dec there weren't any customer-requested cancellations, but that's besides the point here. You talked about multiple confirmed reports, but have yet to mention how many others you consider as "multiple".
FYI, I'm not in political courses, that is not my field of study. Some people just can't leave alone the insults, eh?
ANMMark said:
There are numbers to backup my statements, however it's not suitable for public release, obviously. Anyone here who would like to know the real story, may post at NP to check if our customers received incentives, and they'll be able to reply directly, instead of us continually posting responses here to no avail.
No,
NP is not a neutral area (for the ones who are bringing evidence in light). WHT is not a neutral area (for you or us since it will most likely be closed/locked/deleted) but this place has remained neutral. Why move it when it is neutral?
What we WILL get at NP is those same potential customers who were taken in by incentives coming to your rescue by denying it or new customers posting that they recieved no such information.
Why do you keep trying to move and change the places of this discussion? Why do you not answer the questions? Your guilt is only shown by this as you are CLEARLY hiding and side stepping the issues once again. You should work for the Administration here in the U.S., you'd make a great asset.
NP is not a neutral area (for the ones who are bringing evidence in light). WHT is not a neutral area (for you or us since it will most likely be closed/locked/deleted) but this place has remained neutral. Why move it when it is neutral?
What we WILL get at NP is those same potential customers who were taken in by incentives coming to your rescue by denying it or new customers posting that they recieved no such information.
Why do you keep trying to move and change the places of this discussion? Why do you not answer the questions? Your guilt is only shown by this as you are CLEARLY hiding and side stepping the issues once again. You should work for the Administration here in the U.S., you'd make a great asset.
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Senad said:
You wanted proof. There isn't any hard evidence I can provide except my statements, therefore the hard evidence would come from customers. Where can you find some customers? Surely I can't release their info, but at least you can post in a forum they frequently visit.
In that case, what would constitute as evidence for you? You seem to doubt the customers themselves, even the new customers (!), so doesn't make any sense to argue when there isn't any other way to clarify further
See first reply. I've answered all questions to the best of my abilities (even when we're all busy), but they are not backed up with hard evidence, as I repeatedly said. Any questions posted by Blue, you and Artashes were all answered with statements such as their domains, company history, and so forth. Re-read the discussion and for the questions you think I can answer without the need for customers to post proof, let me know.
Senad said:
BTW, by still posting here, isn't it clear I'm not avoding the situation? I can just as easily decide not to discuss this any further way back, but decided the questions posed were able to be answered, and thus I did. You may want counterevidence, but that does not mean I didn't provide explanations to the questions already asked... Period.
WAYS YOU SIDE-STEP AND DECITE THE ISSUE:
Side-Step #1:
Now....reading these quotes....you state you will take action....yet he is still considered PolurNet staff....
http://forums.polurnet.com/index.php?showuser=10
I have a screenshot of the above so if you decide to change it...as you most likely will...I will post the screenshot of him still considered PolurNet staff. If he lied then why would you still keep him hired...interesting...especially after you stated you will take immediate action.
Side-Step #2:
but then....
Which one is it? It is either he was a customer at PNET or he wasn't at that time....
Side-Step #3:
You will not post here anymore yet you will...
Care for me to pick out a few more? Just promise you won't edit your posts...Your story is lacking and is being altered at times when necessary. I'll let blue pick it apart further since he's good at this stuff
.
PolurNET said:
PolurNET said:
PolurNET said:
Side-Step #1:
Now....reading these quotes....you state you will take action....yet he is still considered PolurNet staff....
http://forums.polurnet.com/index.php?showuser=10
I have a screenshot of the above so if you decide to change it...as you most likely will...I will post the screenshot of him still considered PolurNet staff. If he lied then why would you still keep him hired...interesting...especially after you stated you will take immediate action.
Side-Step #2:
.....ok
but then....
Which one is it? It is either he was a customer at PNET or he wasn't at that time....
Side-Step #3:
You will not post here anymore yet you will...
Care for me to pick out a few more? Just promise you won't edit your posts...Your story is lacking and is being altered at times when necessary. I'll let blue pick it apart further since he's good at this stuff
.Again you have not answered all the questions. What you have done is side-step the issue. Why should I not question customers that may have sold themselves out possibly?
I asked why we should move the topic from HD as they have been open, honest in reading the issue. Your only suggest for proving evidence is still to side-step and just move the issue to another forum? I find this very strange.
Evidence is simple, it is proof that people like JMWeb have posted here. We had to submit our proof to Artashes in order to get this topic re-opened. We proved our evidence and you have yet to do anything but try to side-step instead of getting to the point and answering the questions that arise in this new evidence.
I asked why we should move the topic from HD as they have been open, honest in reading the issue. Your only suggest for proving evidence is still to side-step and just move the issue to another forum? I find this very strange.
Evidence is simple, it is proof that people like JMWeb have posted here. We had to submit our proof to Artashes in order to get this topic re-opened. We proved our evidence and you have yet to do anything but try to side-step instead of getting to the point and answering the questions that arise in this new evidence.
Senad said:
First priority is finding a replacement, we're not going to fire someone and then have our customers suffer during this time. Secondly, our vice is not back yet from a trip, thus will need to discuss this with him.
Think you misread it:
....as a staff member.
He's been a customer for about 5 months, hosting erudnet with us.
Thus, he was always a customer, posted a review about us, after sold erudnet to another company, then came back to us for help, then we hired him. Clear now?
You don't want me to post now?? Yet you want me to not side-step... uh-huh
Care for me to pick out a few more? Just promise you won't edit your posts...Your story is lacking and is being altered at times when necessary. I'll let blue pick it apart further since he's good at this stuff
Sure pick more, but read them properly before you jump conclusions, you seem to do that often.
Senad said:
For the ones you asked so far, seems you didn't read properly, not a case of side-stepping, Senad!
Exactly, you want hard proof. Do I have a newsletter I can post? Sure, I have the one we sent. Is that enough proof? No, because you'll say whatever we sent is not right. Second possible proof is to provide the emails customers sent to me when I asked them to let me know if they received the addon to the original newsletter (that's what jmweb posted). Is that enough proof for you? Likely not, you'll say I faked the headers or some BS.
Thus, what proof is left? Asking the customers directly if they got incentives. There's also $NP Transaction history, PayPal history, and the bunch, but posting them publically or having public access to it, is not feasible.
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PolurNET said:
No because he had a server at HostDime correct? So why would he be a customer of your own? This entire discussion with eRude is making no sense period as you state he had his own server and then wanted to sell, got scammed, and came to you as help.
Also, if he lied and you are keeping him...this seems rather bad. I wouldn't wait to immediatly terminate employement for those that have lied on their application.
I read it very clearly, the only thing that can confuse me is your continual changes and edits.
Senad said:
One at hostdime, one at LayeredTech. HostDime was used for shoutcast and his personal things, LT was used for resellers. We got the LT one, the dimenoc one eventually crashed and the datacenter claimed responsibility.
Why? He wanted to host shared clients with us, on Xeons (I said this at least 5 times, you need glasses). Also, it's a good idea to keep customer data and billing on a separate server than the one you use for hosting clients. Thus by hosting his main erudnet domain with us, it only shows a smart technical aspect of what he did.
Considering he has been very helpful, and has done everything fabulously so far with us, the age was the issue he mentioned on FWS that most people were scared about. However, he proved his word that he knows his stuff, and therefore, unlike the others we hire/fire frequently, he gained our respect from our management.
haha, considering the edits have already been done and I can't modify them any longer, and there's also 3 minute time limit to edit, nice try to transfer the blame!
Senad said:
Another case that you need to improve your reading skills:
I cleary said he didn't formally submit an application at least twice. I only asked his age in passing during a staff meeting, as he acted mature enough to be with the rest of us. Therefore, age is not the primary concern here, he is an honest worker and has proved his skills (even look at his staff position, he started from first-level)
Age IS a primary concern. You are hiring illegally without the proper papers or paying taxes the the country.PolurNET said:
Reading skills or not the story still doesn't make sense. He had two servers one for personal and one for his company yet he didn't use his personal to host his company site? A kid at age 15 REALLY has that much money?
You sir need to improve your business skills. Hiring without applications is first of all illegal. Secondly you have no idea who you truly are hiring. Third of all it also states that you are not paying proper taxes which you can be persecuted for. When information like this comes out it definetly shows that you are a shady dealer. Hiring children that are under age and paying them, god know what amount per hour, is more than enough evidence to prove to me that you have done shady dealings.
This brings me back to the original theme in this topic is about. You posting incentives.
Since you clearly have done this shady dealing along with posting on a competitors forums, which you had no right to do since the transaction was not complete. I can also state that you are not showing me any counter evidence to counter new evidence JMWeb has shown us and the community, and because of this, I can safely assume, as can the rest of the community, that the evidence in hand is true and that you did offer incentives for advertisments UNTIL you can PROVE us otherwise. JMWeb didn't speak by words here, he spoke by showing evidence. All you are doing is speaking by words yet you show no counter-evidence or proof.
Senad said:
We do file our papers properly and indepdently audited by a third-party company that deals with business operations.
Yes, he did make enough money, but obviously there was an intent to sell when he couldn't handle it after a while. That's the point of selling!
We do file as I said our papers with the appropriate third-party company that follows these procedures. He has also informed me that he is 16 years of age since joining us, which I have checked meets the requirements of any organization; I worked myself when I was that age at the local library. As for the salaries, they are within expectations of legal business, and by no means "illegal" as you come to conclude.
Apparently you haven't read my post about posting counter-evidence. Indeed, if I do post transaction history, that is not feasible for public viewing. If I post email headers with customer emails sent about whether they received incentives, they obviously are going to be denied by all parties here as being made up or some other BS. If you allow me to post them, feel free to let me know. You could equally post on the forum that most of our customers visit, and get the answer yourself, direct from the source.
If you don't want us to speak without evidence, so be it; that is the reason I have given up a while ago (if you actually read properly that is) on providing any more information here.
Nevertheless, with you posing questions, then going back to asking evidence shows the stupidity of the situation. If you want the evidence, I've told you what you can do: ask the customers. If you want answers to the questions, I have provided them here. If you're not satisfied with both, you have personal problems I can't deal with, thus not an issue here at all.
Q.E.D
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And you guys thought working 3.5 hours a day for $25 a month was bad. Checkout Polurnets last job offer...
http://www.namepros.com/for-sale-ad...olurnet-communications-looking-new-staff.html
http://www.namepros.com/for-sale-ad...olurnet-communications-looking-new-staff.html
PolurNet said:
PolurNET, so far you have made an impression that you are a very solid company. You not only have "management staff", even "vices", but you also employ a number of people. All leads me to believe that you are a registered corporation generating enough cash to afford competitive (or at least minimal) employee pay, and hence eligible financial brackets to pay taxes. I will save you the trouble: a company generating above $8,150 CAD annually, should file and pay taxes; and ANY registered company, even if income is $0 CAD, should nevertheless file what is called an "Annual Return" (it only costs $20 if done on the government web site).
Keep in mind that to employ people, you HAVE to be a registered entity. However, I searched the Federal Corporations database for "polurnet" and the search came empty. Could you please tell me the registered name of your company?
Also, not clear... if you are saying a third-party deals with business operations, then its not you who hired a 15-year old in the first place? I thought you dealt with him directly, as you said so many times? Then if a third-party is responsible for hiring decisions, what does it say about them to be hiring minors without "proper application" and screening process?
Minimum wage rates as May 1, 2005 in Canadian currency:
General rate
$7.60 / hour
Employees who usually receive tips
$6.85 / hour
So how can you say your rates are legal?
Keep in mind that to employ people, you HAVE to be a registered entity. However, I searched the Federal Corporations database for "polurnet" and the search came empty. Could you please tell me the registered name of your company?
Please provide a name of your independent auditor, and their contact information. Tip: Usually, those are registered and certified accounting/law firms.PolurNET said:
Also, not clear... if you are saying a third-party deals with business operations, then its not you who hired a 15-year old in the first place? I thought you dealt with him directly, as you said so many times? Then if a third-party is responsible for hiring decisions, what does it say about them to be hiring minors without "proper application" and screening process?
Yes, a 16-year old can be employed without contract, as far as I know (I have to check up on that). But the salary cannot be less than a minimal hourly wage required by law. You are operating in the province of Quebec, so what you are required to be paying by law (Civil Code of Quebec) is this:PolurNET said:
Minimum wage rates as May 1, 2005 in Canadian currency:
General rate
$7.60 / hour
Employees who usually receive tips
$6.85 / hour
So how can you say your rates are legal?
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