could be the end of the "Unlimited" marketing gimmick

Unlimited is still allowed for mobile carriers as long as they don't throttle your connection speed. I have Sprint and I've never been throttled on my unlimited plan.

I honestly don't see the term, "unlimited," going away as it's related to webhosting.
 
They can always change the name to "unmetered" like the misleading and/or shadier hosts do
 
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This is really different. They're actually being throttled, an unlimited host shouldn't (and wouldn't) limit/throttle you as long as you're following the terms you agreed to when signing up. A common example, not using it to store backups.

I've said it before and will again, in this day and age disk space and bandwidth is not relevant.
 
This is really different. .

You have to remember that most of the hosts here don't know the difference between used disk space and allocated disk space, or the difference between human imposed limits and physcially imposed limits. Is it no wonder that they don't know the difference between throttling and allocating?
 
Some hosts will always offer unlimited space.

One way or another, there is always a limit to the amount of space/bandwidth you can use. Therefore it is never actually unlimited!
 
Some hosts will always offer unlimited space.

One way or another, there is always a limit to the amount of space/bandwidth you can use. Therefore it is never actually unlimited!

First, the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited. You can have unlimited disk space just as easily on a 4 GB thumb drive as on a 40 TB NAS

Similarly in a calling plan, it refers the number of minutes of call time that is allocated; not the actual number of minutes in a day or month. Thus if by some act of the UN the calendar was changed and number of minutes in a month changed, you can still call the plan unlimited minutes

Second, the subject of the court case was network throttling, not the actual offering of an unlimited plan. In his zeal to bash his competition, the OP got it wrong.

Somewhere I posted some pics of Windows and Linux screen shots showing unlimited disk space as defined and labeled by the OS (not by me or a host). Maybe I should repost them.....
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so explain how i can get 1000+ GB on on 4GB thumb drive?

it is LIMITED to 4GB, you cant get any more than 4GB

Read my post above (and a computer book). Its explained there. Maybe that's why you didn't quote the sentence above the one you did -- you don't want people to see it and how silly you are being

Disk space in a hosting plan refers to the quota configured by the provider (via control panel or native tools) in the OS, not the size of a physical drive. You really need to get outside your control panel and look at the OS
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Read my post above (and a computer book). Its explained there. Maybe that's why you didn't quote the sentence above the one you did -- you don't want people to see it and how silly you are being

Disk space in a hosting plan refers to the quota configured by the provider (via control panel or native tools) in the OS, not the size of a physical drive. You really need to get outside your control panel and look at the OS
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You mentioned the 4GB thumb drive, which it has a 4GB limited . i asked you

explain how i can get 1000+ GB on on 4GB thumb drive

you cant as it has a LIMIT of 4GB
 
You mentioned the 4GB thumb drive, which it has a 4GB limited . i asked you



you cant as it has a LIMIT of 4GB

Its explained in the post, that's why you only quote the conclusion and not the explanation that comes before it. Here is what you don't want your readers to see. I requote my own post:


....the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited. You can have unlimited disk space just as easily on a 4 GB thumb drive as on a 40 TB NAS

Again, don't believe me, look at what the OS reports when you don't allocate quota. But you will have to learn how to view server properties without a control panel.

I'd refer you to some good server management books on Amazon that explains it in more detail, but we have to get your reading comprehension skills up a bit first.

I won't mention your hypocrisy of offering unlimited hosting yourself. The difference between you and I is: I do it knowing how it works and that its real, you offer it believing its a lie.
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I'd refer you to some good server management books on Amazon that explains it in more detail, but we have to get your reading comprehension skills up a bit first.

First and foremost, lets not be childish and result to insulting each other.
If you don't agree with someone's opinions, you're welcome to disagree or take your toys and go to your own sandbox, but there's is no reason to be childish.


First, the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited.

"Unlimited" is defined as "not limited; unrestricted; unconfined"
No matter how you spin it, all plans have limits, and therefore are not unlimited!

It may be a limit to the amount of space, the amount of IOPS, content, etc. There are many ways to limit a hosting plan besides a disk space quota allocation.

As to your argument that the physical hardware is irrelevant, let me ask you, can I host a single website on your shared account, and use 10TB of space?
If it's low traffic, it won't hit your IOPS/RAM/CPU limit.
If all files are available to the public, it won't violate your no file sharing policy.
If none of it is copyrighted, warez, porn, etc it wouldn't violate your fair use policy.

(although all of the limits above, are in fact limits, therefore it couldn't be unlimited if any of those are enforced)

So, would you allow this?
 
First and foremost, lets not be childish and result to insulting each other.
If you don't agree with someone's opinions, you're welcome to disagree or take your toys and go to your own sandbox, but there's is no reason to be childish.

Its not a matter of opinion, its a matter of facts. There is some history here. I've explained the factual concept and factual differences of quota allocations versus hardware capacity to this person on several occasions. He never refutes the explanation, he just proceeds as if there were no explanations ever given.

I'll get to your technical questions in another reply
 
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As promised....

"Unlimited" is defined as "not limited; unrestricted; unconfined"
No matter how you spin it, all plans have limits, and therefore are not unlimited!

Your dfinition is appropriate. However, your complete statement is a logical fallacy within a logical fallacy. Even though your statement is a non-sequiter and assumes the very thing you are trying to prove, I will attempt a reasoned response.

What you have not defined here is the concept of a (shared web) Hosting Plan. My working definition is: A "Hosting Plan" is a basket of Hosting Resources available for rent. These are typically listed on the host's web site as hosting plan boxes. For the "Limited Host" each resource listed is limited by a quota; that quota, or limit, is determined by the host and displayed in the hosting plan.

The "Unlimited Host" uses your primary definition of "unlimited" as being "not limited," a you described it. And recall from above, the thing that is doing the limiting in the first place is the host/provider through the use of quotas. Thus if the host/provider does not utilize a quota then we say that the "stuff" of the quota is not limited, and use the term "unlimited" in the hosting plan to mean just that.


It may be a limit to the amount of space, the amount of IOPS, content, etc. There are many ways to limit a hosting plan besides a disk space quota allocation.

While that may be true in the general sense, that is not what is occuring. Hosting plans, by definition, don't include things like %CPU or GB RAM (ok, vps plans do, but not shared web hosting plans). No unlimited host is referring to cpu, ram, inodes, etc in their hosting plans -- and neither is the limited host. You are equating the TOS with the hosting plan. Both limited and unlimited hosts use similar TOS. A 500 mb wordpress site with a bad plugin can be denied a 3 GB plan -- but that does not mean there is no such thing as a 3 GB plan

To summarize this point - The difference between a limited host and an unlimited host is: the limited host uses the TOS and hosting plan to define limits, while the unlimited host just uses the TOS, and not the HOSTING PLAN.

As to your argument that the physical hardware is irrelevant, let me ask you, can I host a single website on your shared account, and use 10TB of space?
If it's low traffic, it won't hit your IOPS/RAM/CPU limit.
If all files are available to the public, it won't violate your no file sharing policy.
If none of it is copyrighted, warez, porn, etc it wouldn't violate your fair use policy.

(although all of the limits above, are in fact limits, therefore it couldn't be unlimited if any of those are enforced)

So, would you allow this?

Under the terms you listed, yes. However, your list is incomplete. My terms also include 100% linkage and that the primary purpose of the "site" is not to use disk space or bw.

Given my experience, and probably the experience of every single host out there, there is no such thing as a 10 TB web site that meets those conditions making it suitable for a shared hosting environment.

Such questions are silly really. Its like saying you can't offer unlimited control panel licenses. Why? Because you can't deliver on a 10 trillion license order. Such is is the logic of the anti-unlimited crowd.

I'll leave you with this. Behold! Here is what unlimited disk space looks like on a Linux server (the names were changed to protect the guilty). 0 = No Limit = Unlimited:

PHP:
# repquota /home
*** Report for user quotas on device /dev/sda3
Block grace time: 7days; Inode grace time: 7days
                        Block limits                File limits
User            used    soft    hard  grace    used  soft  hard  grace
----------------------------------------------------------------------
root    --  566488       0       0           5401     0     0
RDOS    --    1448       0       0             30     0     0
NiceD   -- 1419352       0       0           1686     0     0
Art     --   26604       0       0            172     0     0

Who here is going to try and convince us that the OS is lying? Perhaps along with the outrageous scnearios like 10 TB sites suitable for shared hosting environment, someone will invent a CLI argument #there is no such thing as \unlimited"

So many hosts here puff their chests and claim "there is no such thing as unlimited" but have no qualms about offering unlimited email, unlimited databases, unlimited domains, etc. This is nothing but hypocrisy and ignorance -- or FUD marketing. Now they try to disguise it as "unmetered" lest they reveal their hypocrisy. Don't they know there is no such thing as unmetered hard drives? There is not even any such thing as a metered one! :uhh:
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I am well aware of the ability to remove limits in Cent. No one has argued that point.

The point of this thread is the validity of "unlimited" hosting

The point that you are skirting around, is that if there are any limits, via Inodes, resource usage, etc, then you are imposing limits, and therefore your hosting is not limited.

You are simply using a marketing gimmick to give your customers the impression that they can host anything they want on your $4/mo plan. However, this is not the case.

Advertising unlimited plans is right up there with promising 100% uptime. It is easy to advertise, not possible to provide.

You can sell "unlimited" hosting, and it will work fine for 99% of your customers. But "unlimited hosting" is not "not limited; unrestricted; unconfined".
You can promise 100% uptime, and you may be able to provide it 99% of the time, but it is not something you can actually guarantee.
 
The point of this thread is the validity of "unlimited" hosting

The point that you are skirting around, is that if there are any limits, via Inodes, resource usage, etc, then you are imposing limits, and therefore your hosting is not limited.
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The only thing that is being claimed as unlimited are the resources listed in the hosting plan. The term "unlimited hosting" refers to a type of hosting plan. I've already said as much in many different ways -- no skirting here. You are either a liar or ignorant if you are saying I am claiming anything else as unlimited. If you don't get that by now, or you are insisting that hosts are not allowed to distinguish between a hosting plan and a TOS, or that they are one in the same, there is no use talking to you about it
 
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The only thing that is being claimed as unlimited are the resources listed in the hosting plan

But yet you said yourself, that you do in fact impose limits.

To summarize this point - The difference between a limited host and an unlimited host is: the limited host uses the TOS and hosting plan to define limits, while the unlimited host just uses the TOS, and not the HOSTING PLAN.

You just use your TOS to do so.

You are either a liar or ignorant if you are saying I am claiming anything else as unlimited.

I am surely not ignorant nor a liar. We make our limits clear and don't promise things we cant live up to.

If you don't get that by now there is no use talking about it

I concur. Good night
 
The last time a thread like this existed, it turned into a giant argument with both 'sides' stating the same things under different words and phrases. I was at the center of it all.

There's just no way that either side of the web hosting community can get along. Both sides believe the other is ignorant to some unknown truths. While Collabora is accurate in regards to how unlimited hosting works, I can see how some may believe that the term is misleading, because quite simply, it is. Unlimited only exists on an operating system level, and is something that most consumers won't understand. If you throw the term at an average consumer, he'll wrongly assume that it means he can host an unlimited amount of data with no restrictions. That's just not how it works.

The fact that there's so much confusion around a single term, both by consumers and even some website hosting professionals, honestly bothers me. It shows that general system knowledge isn't being shared or made easily discoverable by the masses, and companies from multiple industries are taking advantage of false knowledge, and using it as a marketing term for their own gain.

Unlimited is a technical term, and is being marketed to a nontechnical every-day audience. Unlimited hosting packages themselves aren't what needs to be adjusted, it's the mindset of the unlimited hosting provider that needs to change.
 
Both sides believe the other is ignorant to some unknown truths. While Collabora is accurate in regards to how unlimited hosting works, I can see how some may believe that the term is misleading, because quite simply, it is. Unlimited only exists on an operating system level, and is something that most consumers won't understand.

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If you throw the term at an average consumer, he'll wrongly assume that it means he can host an unlimited amount of data with no restrictions. That's just not how it works.

In my dealings with people its the hosts that are more confused than the consumer. The consumer, reads the hosting plan and sees unlimited this, unlimited that. The hosts we find here take that beyond what is presented in the hosting plan and thereby confuse the matter. (If they are not already confused by comparing a myriad of multi-tiered quota based plans)

Of the hundreds or thousands of posts I have seen in various forums re unlimited hosting one that I have never seen is one from a consumer complaining that they were not allowed to substitute a dedicated server for an unlimited hosting plan, which is what the anti-unlimited crowd claim the unlimited host is promising. So who's the one that is truly confused?

And you are correct that the term "unlimited" operates on the OS level and the consumer may not understand that. But keep in mind, that all these debates we see here (and some of the recent posts here demonstrate this) are always among hosts who presumably should understand that, but behave as if they do not. That's the sad part

An issue that the the so-called unlimited host faces is that they are sort of stuck describing their hosting within the conventional framework of the typical series of multi-tiered quota-based hosting plans (and I'lll claim there are more confusing than a single unlimited plan that could replace them all). If anyone has a suggestion on alternative ways to present a hosting plan, that would be pleasing and understandable by consumer I am ready to listen
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