are some people dumb?

easyhostmedia

easyhostmedia

Well-known member
I just got 2 orders which i would say are from the same person. both same country/gmail email address and variations of the same name

order 1
address: Poonsin Thani Khlong Song Ton Nun Lat Krabang Bangkok
Host Name: node-4ip.pool-118-172.dynamic.totbb.net
IP Address: 118.172.22.225
Country: Thailand
Country code: TH (THA)
Region:
City:
Postal code:
Calling code: +66
Longitude: 100
Latitude: 15


order 2
address: Poonsin Thani Khlang Song Tan Nin Lat Krabang Bangkok
Host Name: ppp-115-87-77-15.revip4.asianet.co.th
IP Address: 115.87.77.15
Country: Thailand
Country code: TH (THA)
Region: Krung Thep
City: Bangkok
Postal code:
Calling code: +66
Longitude: 100.5014
Latitude: 13.754


both of these tried to order the same VPS package, while order 1 passed Maxmind fraud checked order 2 failed.
either way i cancelled order 1 before any invoice was paid as it is fishy that 2 identical orders are placed with variations of names and addresses from the same area of the same asian country
 
Why do you cancel an order before a payment was made? In this particular case it was probably a good idea. But people make mistakes. You'd better give one a call or just send email and ask for an ID.
 
HostColor said:
Why do you cancel an order before a payment was made? In this particular case it was probably a good idea. But people make mistakes. You'd better give one a call or just send email and ask for an ID.
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simple, as 2 orders for identical plans (£3.99 VPS), variation of clients name and address ( order 2 address fake, so maxmind blocked this order). both also used different hostnames/IPs, so most likely proxy. If it was 1 order than yes i would have emailed for ID, but always wary of any orders from Asian countries
 
easyhostmedia said:
simple, as 2 orders for identical plans (£3.99 VPS), variation of clients name and address ( order 2 address fake, so maxmind blocked this order). both also used different hostnames/IPs, so most likely proxy. If it was 1 order than yes i would have emailed for ID, but always wary of any orders from Asian countries
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Thank you for your time, but didn't you see "In this particular case it was probably a good idea". It's not about explaining me how does one deal with the fraud score, MaxMind and fraudulent orders :) Though that there are many things I'd love to learn, this is probably not one of them :)

PS: I have nothing to do with Asia, but true or not, things like "… always wary of any orders from Asian countries" might sound improper to many.
 
HostColor said:
PS: I have nothing to do with Asia, but true or not, things like "… always wary of any orders from Asian countries" might sound improper to many.
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dont get many orders from Asia, but 11 years as a web host I have gained a sixth sense to what are genuine and what are fraud orders by the way they place orders.
 
easyhostmedia said:
dont get many orders from Asia, but 11 years as a web host I have gained a sixth sense to what are genuine and what are fraud orders by the way they place orders.
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Having experience helps a lot, I know that. However it is something you either have or haven't. Those who are relatively new in the industry would better take their time to speak to potential customers and get better experience in fraud prevention.
 
HostColor said:
Having experience helps a lot, I know that. However it is something you either have or haven't. Those who are relatively new in the industry would better take their time to speak to potential customers and get better experience in fraud prevention.
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would never be able to call them as the phone number is too short even for asia and they even gave their DOB as 00/00/0000
 
I would say my feelings were correct as if they were after a genuine server for legit reasons, then by now i would have expected a call or an email asking why the order was cancelled
 
easyhostmedia said:
true


According to Google maps this is the location for order 1


pc screenshot
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Not defending anyone but Google Maps is not a good place to go to find accurate addresses. Many times I have looked for an address but found the actual door I am looking for to be up further down the road.

HostColor said:
Why do you cancel an order before a payment was made? In this particular case it was probably a good idea. But people make mistakes. You'd better give one a call or just send email and ask for an ID.
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You cancel fraudulent orders after a payment is made? Sounds like a good way to get your chargeback ratios up ^^ :). Best stop these orders before they are passed and paid, in doing so preventing further issues.

HostColor said:
PS: I have nothing to do with Asia, but true or not, things like "… always wary of any orders from Asian countries" might sound improper to many.
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Could not agree more. When I first read that I was a little taken back :crash:

WebHostWala said:
I would suggest you to keep a close eye on the order - this could be used for spamming or any fishing activities..
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You should read the original post as both orders were indeed cancelled promptly.
 
And what about if the client just decided that he wants to hide his real details and thus placing a second order with fake details through a proxy instead of completing the first one?

Even though those are typically fraudulent cases, I wouldn't deny anyone the right of a phone call. Just a quick call to ask where they are, why some details might differ from the order or to let them know that you see similar orders with different details and to ask about the reason. Now if he is a fraud, most likely they won't even pick up the phone (or have access to it in that matter). And the whole process would take no more than a couple of minutes even though it might end the same way :)
 
Rado_Ch said:
And what about if the client just decided that he wants to hide his real details and thus placing a second order with fake details through a proxy instead of completing the first one?
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It is easy to detect a proxy, you have to think checking many things like email, hostname of the user IP, check if the IP is black listed for spam, many layers that you can check until you'll cancel the order.

It depends of your standards of security. I realize that instead to have 1000 fraudulent orders it is better to have 2 legit orders. Do you picture it?

Regards
 
Rado_Ch said:
And what about if the client just decided that he wants to hide his real details and thus placing a second order with fake details through a proxy instead of completing the first one?
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the first 1 completed to the point of generated invoice, but seconds later the second one with false details. so the original order was cancelled and marked fraud before the invoice was paid. If it was a genuine order and it was me then i would have been contacting the host demanding why my order was marked as fraud and the invoice i received is marked as cancelled.

given the country of the order placed in and the second fake order then i would say this was 100% someone trying to get an order to use the server for illegal activities.

Also post #9 explains that i would never have been able to call them.
 
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Rado_Ch said:
And what about if the client just decided that he wants to hide his real details and thus placing a second order with fake details through a proxy instead of completing the first one?

Even though those are typically fraudulent cases, I wouldn't deny anyone the right of a phone call. Just a quick call to ask where they are, why some details might differ from the order or to let them know that you see similar orders with different details and to ask about the reason. Now if he is a fraud, most likely they won't even pick up the phone (or have access to it in that matter). And the whole process would take no more than a couple of minutes even though it might end the same way :)
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In most cases ordering through a proxy is a little extreme and ordering the first time then re-ordering having decided to go without a trace is a rare one ;).

That being said a phone call or some ID verification would of been nice in that case.
 
Alex - Ezpz said:
That being said a phone call or some ID verification would of been nice in that case.
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you cant call them if they have gave an incomplete/fake phone number and i dare say the gmail email would go unanswered as so fare this person has made no contact to see why his ordered have been marked fraud.
 
rowebca said:
It is easy to detect a proxy, you have to think checking many things like email, hostname of the user IP, check if the IP is black listed for spam, many layers that you can check until you'll cancel the order.

It depends of your standards of security. I realize that instead to have 1000 fraudulent orders it is better to have 2 legit orders. Do you picture it?

Regards
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I think you misunderstood me :)
I am well aware of various verification methods, here we are hypothetically the client and assuming that some clients are not aware that their hosts have numerous ways to detect fraud. In this imaginary case, I, as a client, before submitting my payment, decide that I want to put different details on my order. I am not aware that the host can see my unfinished order and that they have a verification check to avoid such false details.

Like I said - most probably fraud, but no one should be denied a simple call for double-checking. Gained some pretty loyal customers, initially looking as frauds back in the days :rolleyes2

Edit: Missed a couple of posts with vital info, sorry. In your case - most definitely fraud, yes :)
 
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easyhostmedia said:
I would say my feelings were correct as if they were after a genuine server for legit reasons, then by now i would have expected a call or an email asking why the order was cancelled
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You did the right thing cancelling the order. I would've done the same thing.

Chad
 
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