Web host that believes in free speech?

DrBenway

New member
I am based in the US but don't trust web hosts in the US to keep my sight running if they get pushback from the public or gov't. My website will be for a podcast that I'm starting. It will be a very simple site, just hosting the web player from the podcast host to play my episodes. I really like Iceland as a hosting country because they have strong free speech laws. Does anyone have any experience or suggestions for me? Thanks.
 

bigredseo

HD Community Advisor
Staff member
It's tough to outrun the US Government, even when it comes to the Free Speach end of things.

Most countries, including Iceland, have agreements with the US Government in that they can, and will, turn over data, logs and machines if requested. Of course, that all falls under terms like "national security" etc.

Even behind a paywall, that won't exclude you from prying eyes. While I haven't gone hunting myself, I'm not aware of many places that you could host. I know there are "bulletproof" type hosting for email campaigns etc, maybe that's a starting area?
 

DrBenway

New member
It's tough to outrun the US Government, even when it comes to the Free Speach end of things.

Most countries, including Iceland, have agreements with the US Government in that they can, and will, turn over data, logs and machines if requested. Of course, that all falls under terms like "national security" etc.

Even behind a paywall, that won't exclude you from prying eyes. While I haven't gone hunting myself, I'm not aware of many places that you could host. I know there are "bulletproof" type hosting for email campaigns etc, maybe that's a starting area?
My only concern is whether they'll be able to shut down the site. That would take a court order according to Icelandic law, served to the web host, providing the server itself is in Iceland.
 

bigredseo

HD Community Advisor
Staff member
Possibly. I had a look at some of the documents for Iceland and they do mention the compliance of companies with the magistrate, but that's all after legal proceedings. The question comes down to the liability of the host before and while, legal proceedings are taking place - or how much leeway is provided to the government to step in and bypass court ruling.

I guess a determination needs to be made in regards to how far "out of the box" is the topic and conversation is. (I"m not asking you to disclose that, purely providing food for thought). When all else fails I guess you could use a system/host similar to WikiLeaks - but be prepared for a big pricetag as they need that in order to fend off court claims.
 
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DrBenway

New member
Possibly. I had a look at some of the documents for Iceland and they do mention the compliance of companies with the magistrate, but that's all after legal proceedings. The question comes down to the liability of the host before and while, legal proceedings are taking place - or how much leeway is provided to the government to step in and bypass court ruling.

I guess a determination needs to be made in regards to how far "out of the box" is the topic and conversation is. (I"m not asking you to disclose that, purely providing food for thought). When all else fails I guess you could use a system/host similar to WikiLeaks - but be prepared for a big pricetag as they need that in order to fend off court claims.
Yeah, thanks for looking at it, I figured it would be at least somewhat difficult unlike russia where the gov't can do whatever it wants. I would be going out of my way to not break the law, just saying things about political/social issues that would make certain groups very angry.
 

bigredseo

HD Community Advisor
Staff member
I was bored - like I didn't have a crap ton of work to be doing - and started hunting online with regards to Freedom of Speech and where different countries ranked with regards to tolerance. Oddly enough, the USA ranks at the top of the list with the most relaxed laws regarding Freedom of Speech and what you can get away with.


Looking through the Wikipedia page, it didn't even mention Iceland (which I thought was weird given the other things I've read on them)

This site has a whole Index rating system - the first chart on the page gives a clear view of how oppressed parts of the world are - https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/countries-with-freedom-of-speech

Still, as with anything, there are rules to Free Speech. Defamation, Inciting Violence, and other common-law ideas are not covered under Free Speech. National Security, false statements, perjury, false advertising, terrorist threats, trade secrets, blasphemy and other items are also not covered in some countries.

I love Brazil's version in their Consitution in Article 4;
"manifestation of thought is free, but anonymity is forbidden"


***** I am so sorry ... I really took this question/discussion in a completely different direction!! - feel free to flag it for an admin and it can be moved into General Discussion.
 

server

Member
I didn't see any point posting about 5 eyes countries (since probably everybody knows about this), but today's news about Mr. McAfee hanging himself in Spain's prison after decision was made about his extradition to US brought these thoughts back.

5-eyes.png

There are no completely neutral countries, where you can be completely safe. All countries are under influence or have agreements with world's most powerful ones. In most cases hosting content in China or Russia doesn't seem as rational option, but sometimes they may be the best options available.
 

SenseiSteve

HD Moderator
Staff member
I didn't see any point posting about 5 eyes countries (since probably everybody knows about this), but today's news about Mr. McAfee hanging himself in Spain's prison after decision was made about his extradition to US brought these thoughts back.


There are no completely neutral countries, where you can be completely safe. All countries are under influence or have agreements with world's most powerful ones. In most cases hosting content in China or Russia doesn't seem as rational option, but sometimes they may be the best options available.
We part ways when considering hosting content in Russia or China may be the best option available. And it seems today that everything posted is controversial to someone.
 

server

Member
We part ways when considering hosting content in Russia or China may be the best option available. And it seems today that everything posted is controversial to someone.
It's worth considering, perhaps, only 1 time from 100. But that 1 correct choice can save your life, even if we talk about hosting someone's butt. Ask Snowden.
 

SenseiSteve

HD Moderator
Staff member
It's worth considering, perhaps, only 1 time from 100. But that 1 correct choice can save your life, even if we talk about hosting someone's butt. Ask Snowden.
Probably closer to 1 time in 2 billion, but who's counting? I get where you're coming from, but Russia and China are hardly pillars for free speech.
 

server

Member
Probably closer to 1 time in 2 billion, but who's counting? I get where you're coming from, but Russia and China are hardly pillars for free speech.
If we talk about western world, as one guy here called it, perhaps those 1999999999 will be busy with rainbow washing and other meaningless stuff.

Free speech is a complex term. Can it be expressed in amount of statements/topics you will be able to say more than once in certain places? If OP is about to make some people angry in US, most likely it will have no or quite an opposite effect if speaking from pillars in aforementioned countries. But it comes not without price to pay. As everything else in this life, if one is willing to dig deeper and to do something more, than only drawing rainbows in June. In western world.
 

easyhostmedia

Well-known member
Cloudflare may be enough to handle this.
I banned Cloudflare on my servers as i don't deal with companies that condone spamming. the amount of spam that spamming hide behind Cloudflare is beyond a joke and Cloudflare could not care less, so in my eyes, they are just as bad as the spammers.
 

Hosting.uk

New member
Web hosting companies are operating within the law and certain rules. If you decide to sign up for any company around the word you have to accept that rules if you need hosting.
 

easyhostmedia

Well-known member
Web hosting companies are operating within the law and certain rules. If you decide to sign up for any company around the word you have to accept that rules if you need hosting.
You have to beware, just because a web hosting company has something within its TOS etc. this does not make it legal.

When I first started out in the hosting business I drafted my TOS and thought I did a good job by covering everything. As I know the head of our local Trading Standards office personally I asked him to have a look over my TOS in case I missed anything.
He gave these over to one of his TS officers to look over and make any appropriate changes to make sure they comply with current UK legislation. when these came back to me I was shocked at what they removed, and what I had to add or change, but I did this, and then any changes I wanted to make I pass over them to approve first, so making sure any changes were within current legislation, so making sure I was within the law at all times.
 

S4 Hosting

Active member
I think this is all relative to what exactly the content we are talking about is. Despite what you might think due to media sensationalism, most webhosts in most countries with relative freedom of speech and media freedom (I'm including the US and most of Europe in that) are not going to have an issue with hosting things that represent different viewpoints or ideologies. If we are talking about inciting violence or hate speech then it all becomes a little bit different.
 

easyhostmedia

Well-known member
most webhosts in most countries with relative freedom of speech and media freedom (I'm including the US and most of Europe in that) are not going to have an issue with hosting things that represent different viewpoints or ideologies. If we are talking about inciting violence or hate speech then it all becomes a little bit different.
Yes true, but any host must also keep up to date with the laws of any country they trade within and whatever country their servers are based in. i.e if your business is based in Spain, then for tax etc. you must comply with Spanish laws, but if your servers are based in the USA then you also need to comply with USA laws and state laws depending on which state your servers are based in, but then if you have UK clients then you also need to comply with UK laws.
 

S4 Hosting

Active member
Yes true, but any host must also keep up to date with the laws of any country they trade within and whatever country their servers are based in. i.e if your business is based in Spain, then for tax etc. you must comply with Spanish laws, but if your servers are based in the USA then you also need to comply with USA laws and state laws depending on which state your servers are based in, but then if you have UK clients then you also need to comply with UK laws.

My point is that in any of the countries that you have just mentioned, you really are not very likely to fall foul of any kind of governmental actions infringing on your free speech rights, unless you are doing one of a few very specific things.
 

Hosting.uk

New member
You have to beware, just because a web hosting company has something within its TOS etc. this does not make it legal.
Yes I agree with you. I just wanted to say wherever the rules exist (TOS, AUP, laws, goverments etc) - free speech ends.
TOS - legal or illegal = rules in any ways. I think that free speech is something about "No rules" .
That what I meant.
 
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